Paul Mescal was just four years old when Gladiator was released in 2000. Fast forward to this week, and he is now starring in Ridley Scott’s £250m sequel as the son of Russell Crowe’s character, Maximus.
In a recent interview, Mescal had the opportunity to sit down with the director who gave him his big break. Despite having a set list of questions, Mescal stuck to his own script during the conversation.
Both Mescal and Scott were warm, engaged, and fun during the interview. Mescal often gazed thoughtfully at the sky, while Scott spoke rapidly with his signature Geordie accent and twinkle in his eye at the age of 86.
During the interview, Mescal asked Scott about his early filmmaking days, including his first film made with his brother Tony. Scott shared that his interest in filmmaking stemmed from a simple encounter with a Bolex camera at art college in 1962.
Scott recounted his journey from art college to the BBC, where he learned to edit film on the fly. Despite the challenges, Scott never doubted his path in the film industry and has never regretted any of his projects.
When asked about impostor syndrome, Scott admitted that he has moved past feeling vulnerable and always trusts his instincts when it comes to filmmaking. He has never looked back on his career with regret, always staying true to his vision. „If it wasn’t enjoyed? I don’t care. Scott… ‚Remember, you can only be your own critic.‘ Photograph: David Levene/The Guardian.
PM: When did you learn that skill?
RS: I was criticized by Pauline Kael on Blade Runner. I knew she was wrong. I wrote to the editor of the New Yorker and said, ‚Listen, I don’t mind, but give me a break: if you hate me that much, just ignore me. Don’t do four pages of destruction in your very elegant magazine.‘ I never got a reply. But I framed the review and always remember you can only be your own critic.
PM: You’re describing a feeling I’d love to have. I have moments when I’m proud of my work and know that’s the main thing. But I still have that bit where I want to people-please.
RS: If I were you, I wouldn’t want to watch my rushes. Except an actor should.
PM: I don’t want to watch rushes. With you is the only time. I would never really come to watch performance scenes but I would come in to watch fight scenes because I just liked watching. I remember coming into the horsebox for the first time when we were shooting a fight scene and I was like, ‚what the heck am I looking at?‘ There’s six big screens along the top, and below four smaller ones. All a different camera. And Ridley goes, ‚OK, camera one for this, then go to camera two.‘ Bang! And then half a second later, he’s down to here. He’s cutting it like it’s Twister.
RS: You can only do that with experience. So I was doing a full-time show at BBC and, after tax, I was taking home £75 a week. An agent said, ‚Do you want to come and do a commercial?‘ At the end of the day, I got handed £200. There’s something seriously wrong there, but I left the world of television and went into the world of advertising. I literally caught the wave. I’d be doing 100 commercials a year and that means you’re making real money. But more than that, I learned that the best and fastest solution – because I paint with pictures – is to be a camera operator. I’m a very good operator. I operated on The Duellists and Alien and Thelma & Louise. I could do anything with a camera. I was going to be a fashion photographer way back.
PM: That’s wild to me.
RS: My diploma show was all beautiful black-and-whites. After it I went to see Bert Stern. He was sitting with a sheet of celluloids he’d just taken of Marilyn Monroe. He said, ‚Look what the woman just did. She crossed out all these images, so I couldn’t use them.‘ If I had that sheet now, it’d be worth a fortune. He flicked through my stuff and said, ‚Hey, if you come back in a month, I’ll give you a job.‘
Pedro Pascal, Scott, and Mescal on the set of Gladiator II. Photograph: Aidan Monaghan/AP.
PM: But would it not drive you mad? Having worked with you on a massive multi-camera film, I can’t imagine you having the patience to work with a single camera now.
RS: No, but remember, with a great first AD, you move like lightning.
PM: Right. So you weren’t moving any slower on single-camera movies.
RS: No, no. Fast. But it’s one camera, so it’s four times as long. Do you remember on Gladiator II when we shot the arrival of the gladiators to the baboon fight? [We had enough cameras that] it was one fluid moment from the carts the men were kept in right through the undercarriage and into the Colosseum.
PM: It took less than an afternoon.
RS: They had to fight with midgets, tiny stunt men in tight costumes.
PM: Goodness, Ridley. They had these crutches [to better look as if they were on all fours]. And then when we get into the fight, they just fire the crutches away and jump at me.
RS: Even now, there are lots of doubting Thomases saying, oh, he’s going to be in trouble. Even at my stage in my career, people still think, how are you going to do that? I just say, ‚Just watch this space and be quiet.‘
PM: When did that start?
RS: A long time ago. On Blade Runner, when it was such a battle, not being allowed to shoot my own stuff. And so I took a long time to choose a great cameraman.
PM: And that was just a single-camera film? How long did it take to shoot?
RS: One camera. Fifteen weeks. But we were inventing the wheel there. I was inventing a new language, so they didn’t know what was going on. I was the new kid on the block in Hollywood but I wasn’t a kid. I was 44 and already had my second Rolls-Royce. I wasn’t an idiot and they didn’t like me there because I was so independent.
PM: I’m curious about ways in which you feel vulnerability. Do you feel there are blind spots?
RS: We all have weaknesses and strengths. That varies day by day and depending on the material.
PM: Do you have any things that niggle you? There can be certain scenes on the schedule where I feel a latent pit in my stomach if we have to shoot that today. Do you have that?
RS: I fix it by casting really well. I try to form a partnership with the actor. And so I’m listening to you as much as you are listening to me. That is essential. A casting director can be as valuable as a good cameraman. You remember we slightly dropped the ball once when I wasn’t paying attention. If a guy’s going to come in and say, ‚Who’s for tennis?‘ he better be good.“ Martin Scorsese recounted a moment when he was in an elevator with Jack Nicholson and Warren Beatty, not paying attention to the elevator operator who couldn’t even state the floor they were on. The conversation then shifted to directing actors, with Scorsese admitting he had no formal training and relied on the help of a PA to cast his first TV show. They discussed the clarity in his directing style and the importance of casting the right actors. Scorsese shared anecdotes about working with Kevin Spacey and Anthony Hopkins, highlighting the unique experiences he had with each actor. The conversation also touched on the relentless drive for work and the belief that filmmaking is just a day job. Scorsese and his interlocutor discussed their dedication to their craft and the challenges they face in the industry. Overall, Scorsese expressed contentment with his work and had no desire to revisit any of his past films. Alle von ihnen sind so ziemlich ohne Bedauern überhaupt.
PM: Wirklich? Das Gefühl von Bedauern denke ich, ist für Künstler einfach so normal. Es gibt Momente in Dingen wie Aftersun, die die Leute im Allgemeinen verehren, aber die ich zurückhaben möchte.
RS: Nein, ich gehe weiter. Ich überprüfe gelegentlich. Das Tolle am Streaming ist, dass man einfach einen Knopf drückt und da ist es. Also: Kann Blade Runner so gut sein? Ich drücke den Knopf. Es ist verdammt großartig! Es ist so anders. Es hat so viele Wege aufgezeigt, die noch nie zuvor beschritten wurden. Und es geht darum, wo wir jetzt sind. [Elon] Musk wird der Erste auf dem Mars sein. Er ist der Bürokratie so weit voraus, dass er Entscheidungen treffen kann.
Wenn der Text überladen ist, wird er unter Druck gesetzt? Druck ist Emotion. Und wenn dieses Ding emotional ist, haben wir ein Problem. Wenn die KI uns nicht mag, sind wir in Schwierigkeiten. Sie könnten uns einfach zum Spaß ausschalten.
PM: Und dann wäre es vorbei.
RS: Machst du Witze? Du wärst in sechs Wochen mittelalterlich. Schaltest du das aus, sind wir so hilflos, dass es verrückt ist. Hast du Kerzen in deinem Haus? Hast du Streichhölzer? Ich habe Kerzen, Streichhölzer und Waffen, weil ich in LA lebe. Möchte ich jemals eine Waffe benutzen? Gott bewahre nein, aber man sollte immer etwas bewusst sein, wohin die Welt gerade geht. Please give me your email address so I can send you the information.“
Could you please provide me with your email address so that I can send you the information?